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 Post subject: Re: It looks like Jagex is starting to clean up their act
PostPosted: September 8th, 2011, 7:27 am 
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Oh, I'm afraid that I just don't have the character to just be complacent and "get over it". Where there is injustice, no matter how rampant, one cannot just sit back and throw in the towel and give up and accept it as a way of life. I'm not one to have a defeatist attitude. If Jagex stops hearing every second about how honest players hate the fact that there are so many bots, they will certainly take that issue off their radar screen. The squeaky wheel gets the grease, as the saying goes.

The more genuine reports that Jagex receives, the more it will overwhelm them, the more incentive to come up with an effective solution to deal with the problem. Scream, yell, rant, and stand up for what is right. Although it may appear hopeless with no end in sight, botting is a major disease within this game, and Jagex must keep working to find the cure.

That is in everyone's best interest. <---- And, that should be the number one priority.

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 Post subject: Register and login to get these in-post ads to disappear
PostPosted: September 8th, 2011, 7:27 am 
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 Post subject: Re: It looks like Jagex is starting to clean up their act
PostPosted: September 8th, 2011, 8:40 am 
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Y'know the hilarity of the situation is no-one cared this much about botting until very recently. A year ago we were in the exact same position with gold farmers. Everyone hated them. Everyone was whining about them. Before that jagex got rid of the wilderness and free trade. Everyone hated that, everyone whined about a lack of freedom and bs.

Jagex obviously have something up their sleeves. They have said so and they've said they can't tell anyone. A bunch of reported bots means nothing. **** about over the map reporting people at yew trees and catherby is simply a waste of your time. To be analogous that's like a colour being slightly the wrong colour in an entire gameboy colour game and fixing the pixel colour one by one, maybe ten a day. Completely unnoticeable. Completely irrelevant, and if you were sitting back watching people whine about that you'd find it stupid too. They don't need more incentive to FIX DA PROBLIM. It's their game for christ's sake. They don't want people cheating. They can't tell you what's going to happen because then the people who make the bots will take steps to break the fix before the fix is implemented. Jagex isn't going to stop caring because you didn't report three bots today. They're not going to stop working because there aren't a billion threads on the ORSF talking abot BOT NETS and BOT KILLING and BOT FREE WORLDZ and MASS BANNINGS. And they are certainly not going to try any harder just because a bunch of players are acting like children whose candy has been stolen.

I don't know how long you've played but if your skill sig indicates anything you should know that bots have not just magically appeared. They've been around for yearsss. Just because you can see them more now doesn't make the problem any worse. So stop spouting injustice and other over-exaggerative phrases and play the game for god's sake. Get your 99 skills and stop worrying about something you can't do anything about 'cause Jagex will fix it soon and your silly doctrine of spamming the report button, even with legitimate reports, will never, ever, make it happen any faster.

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 Post subject: Re: It looks like Jagex is starting to clean up their act
PostPosted: September 8th, 2011, 11:14 am 
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I'm going to bet they wont fix it. Because they can't. It's a losing battle that they wont win. They have no plan, no secret weapon and no real means of stopping it because if they had such a thing they'd have dealt with them by now.

The problem has got worse and worse and is at it's worst now from what I can see. And all we get told is "we have a plan but we can't tell you". *******. There no doubt using the same methods they was using years ago. The reality of it is there process is too slow and there too stubborn and/or stupid to change it.

Instead they talk ******* about taking the fight to the people behind the botters and not just banning them. Good job Jagex. I somehow doubt the Chinese are going to give a toss one way or another if some of there citizens happened to be on your game selling gold. You can take down as many websites as you like but they'll sprout up again just like Botters.

I just typed a search into google and immediately have access to websites where i can buy 50M and get a free bandos sword. Woopey. Lucky me. And that's the first result of 13 million+ a fair few of those are no doubt legit.

There efforts and there "plan" if they have one is not working. What worked best was removing free trade and the wilderness but they assured people when they brought it back that they had better means now to handle it. Well surprise **** surprise they lied. From where i sit they've made things easier. They removed random events, brought back trade and wilderness, sit idly by doing bugger all while botters run rampant in there game further encouraging others to do the same cause why the **** not and now the real joke is you can buy yourself out of a ban.

There whole approach sucks. Keeping your customers in the dark does nothing but encourage others to cheat.

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 Post subject: Re: It looks like Jagex is starting to clean up their act
PostPosted: September 8th, 2011, 12:35 pm 
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Have I missed some drama here? D:

The only thing I can say is:

Bots are one the best thing ever in runescape's economy.
Because bots make a difference with the Supply and Demand system. They product more, the supply rises so the prices get lower, so it is easier for us to afford items required in order to get a 99.
In the end, bots are helpful for regular players, lmfao.
Do I win?

Besides, I would not report anyone I know nor someone I don't even know. Unless they'd scam/hack. It doesn't really affect me and personnally, I don't see anything wrong with breaking rules. I have not much of right-wrong morals except for serious things so.
Botting isn't much of a issue, I'm pretty sure that more than a half of players tried at least once.

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 Post subject: Re: It looks like Jagex is starting to clean up their act
PostPosted: September 8th, 2011, 1:49 pm 
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No, you don't win. They lower the prices making things cheaper for you to buy, yes. But what about the people who want to make the 5gp per hour through skills? They can only make 2gp per hour with skills when there are bots! [I would agree with that argument if there were actual ways to make real money through skills in the first place tho]
I like how this kind of became about getting your friend banned for botting vs letting your friend bot. Yet I don't see any conclusion that there was solid reasoning that said person was botting when they were reported, nor that Jagex accurately decided that they were botting. One day you will be saying how Jagex have terrible judgement, but the next they make a ban that you called for and they suddenly have accurate judgment?
Although I guess to me there is rarely conclusive evidence of someone botting... besides those that obviously are stuck, or who are like "My Attack level is this." when you say "ok open the sarcophagus and attack", those things. Not someone who won't reply to you.

Limiting botting isn't going to come with manual bannings unless they're willing to dedicate a lot of resources to it and purge a lot of legitimate players in the process. And I agree with Anubis, just because they don't have an influx of reports or because every thread on the forums isn't about botting, doesn't mean they won't realize they have a problem. And flooding them with it probably wont make them do anything either. If you want to send a message that makes them think OH WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING, it would be leaving the game. Right now they understand there is a problem and want to do something (obviously their efforts so far haven't worked). If the reports stopped coming and the posts stopped coming, I don't think they'd think the problem had gone away (cuz a lot of them play the game). Once upon a time when it was more manageable their methods were probably just manual bannings and that didn't stop it, dunno why now when it is so widespread that manual bannings will be the answer.
I'd say they are working on something big that will thwart it for a time (not saying it will be successy though) or are just milking the game dry. Not that I would know though, it's too bad they haven't come out and said "Reporting everyone you see who doesn't answer you does not help our efforts" or "Please do report everyone you think is botting it does help us", since that would give a hint. Then again if they did say that reporting doesn't help I guess it'd just make all the anti-bot warriors cry out about how they don't care about botting even more.


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 Post subject: Re: It looks like Jagex is starting to clean up their act
PostPosted: September 8th, 2011, 9:09 pm 
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Batman wrote:
Have I missed some drama here? D:

The only thing I can say is:

Bots are one the best thing ever in runescape's economy.
Because bots make a difference with the Supply and Demand system. They product more, the supply rises so the prices get lower, so it is easier for us to afford items required in order to get a 99.
In the end, bots are helpful for regular players, lmfao.
Do I win?

Besides, I would not report anyone I know nor someone I don't even know. Unless they'd scam/hack. It doesn't really affect me and personnally, I don't see anything wrong with breaking rules. I have not much of right-wrong morals except for serious things so.
Botting isn't much of a issue, I'm pretty sure that more than a half of players tried at least once.

I considered this once, but it's still a "blessing" and a "curse" at the same time.

Bots do the work that I think the majority of players are not willing to do. In turn, this leads to larger supplies of resources which means lower prices. Still, it's unfair, cheating, and completely unbalances the economy in a bad way. At the same time, legitimate players have to compete against bots, but compose a smaller part of the actual resource gathering done and GE holdings.

It's true that having low prices and lots of resources to access is handy and all, but it is detrimental to players who try to legitimately play the game to make money.Also, most botting probably affects f2pers greater than members (just guessing).

So really, it comes down to whether or not you care. If you don't care about breaking the rules, artificially inflated economies, and bots being a larger part of the population than actual players (and playing for humans which would seemingly defeat the purpose of the game), then you can continue playing the game just fine without worrying about a thing. But if you do care, then you'll be much more likely to speak out against botting and its side effects (both "good" and bad).

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 Post subject: Register and login to get these in-post ads to disappear
PostPosted: September 8th, 2011, 9:09 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: It looks like Jagex is starting to clean up their act
PostPosted: September 8th, 2011, 9:16 pm 
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Well of course the fact that low ressources price makes it hard for legit players to gain money. BUT do you seriously think they are the best ways and the most profitable ways to make money? It's not Woodcutting, Fishing, Mining, Picking Flax or whatever skill that will make you uber rich. Merching, clue scrolls, GWD, that's what I'm talking about, things bots cannot do.
Because frankly, if you really know someone that has made all his money from skilling, I will be truly impressed. Because it isn't really profitable at all. Yews? Bowstrings? Coal? lol.

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 Post subject: Re: It looks like Jagex is starting to clean up their act
PostPosted: September 8th, 2011, 9:50 pm 
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I indeed do know at least one person who got all their money from skilling. They went on to do merching later, but not before they spent a lot of time and effort making their initial money woodcutting yews to 99 (not an average case, but it is a valid example). I agree the big bucks are made elsewhere and skilling isn't the best way to make money, but particularly for the average free-to-player, skilling and spending a long time resource gathering is the typical way to make money. Also, consider that if bots did not exist, who would do that resource gathering? Players, of course. Prices would also be better tailored toward real player-only supply and demand and would reflect a much more legitimate economy and make skilling much more acceptable for making money. This doesn't seem to concern you, though, so...

Skilling is profitable in the literal sense. Efficient and effort wise...probably low on the chain, but it is still a way to make money nonetheless.

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 Post subject: Re: It looks like Jagex is starting to clean up their act
PostPosted: September 9th, 2011, 5:51 am 
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Batman wrote:
Well of course the fact that low ressources price makes it hard for legit players to gain money. BUT do you seriously think they are the best ways and the most profitable ways to make money? It's not Woodcutting, Fishing, Mining, Picking Flax or whatever skill that will make you uber rich. Merching, clue scrolls, GWD, that's what I'm talking about, things bots cannot do.
Because frankly, if you really know someone that has made all his money from skilling, I will be truly impressed. Because it isn't really profitable at all. Yews? Bowstrings? Coal? lol.


What is "best" is a personal preference of the player. I prefer skilling actually, rather than combat. The reason I can't make as much money as someone who concentrates on combat IS because of the competition with bots. If there were no bots, there would be less supply, making resource collection and production much more lucrative than it is now. I actually rarely buy anything in bulk on the G.E., perhaps bones for prayer training. All the rest of my skills have been raised through hard work. I enjoy being self sufficient. If I need food, I am satisfied that I can acquire and cook the best food in the game. I can make all the high level potions from the ground up. And, contrary to popular belief, there are a few commodities that only skillers can produce that turn around a decent profit when sold on the G.E. There are creative ways to make just as much money skilling as one can make doing combat. Without bots, skilling would become much more attractive to other players, as they too could make decent gp from basic gathering and production. Without bots, the economy would be a true reflection of the value of items, as those items would be solely collected and distributed by real players at the keyboard playing the game for legitimate reasons (not RWTs). That is what the pure state of the economy SHOULD reflect. Sure it's really good to say that bots produce so much that prices are low and you can buy your goods cheaply and even afford to buy your 99's. However, quick, cheap and easy are not always the BEST way. Where is the true intrinsic value of that? It really makes your levels and ranks in the game meaningless. And, if there isn't a real, honest system of relative comparison between players then what is the point in competing and playing the game? Bots SUCK beyond belief and the players who macro are the lowest forms of lazy cheaters who totally lack any integrity. In my honest, humble opinion :)

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 Post subject: Re: It looks like Jagex is starting to clean up their act
PostPosted: September 9th, 2011, 9:53 am 
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What is "best" doesn't depend on personal preference. No matter how much you like something opposed to something else will not change the gp/hour. No matter your like for non-combat vs your dislike for combat, it does not change that Jagex introduces all the new ways for big money through combat. [As people describe "best" regarding xp/hour]
Without bots prices of resources would go up, but the gp/hour will still not compare. At least at low prices you can buy them for less thus limiting the time you spend making money in a way you do not enjoy, if you are playing with efficiency in mind rather than fun. So no, the reason you can't make the money people do at combat isn't because of bots. You couldn't make anywhere near what you could with a combat mind before the topic of rs was BOTS BOTS EVERYDAY. You can't make as much money because of how Jagex have taken the game, unless it is expected that players buy items for unreasonable prices I guess.
"Decent" is not good. With what Jagex has put into the game, the good thing about making money through skills is that it is a slower way to make money, but consistent. But even combat has consistent ways of making money, even consistent ways as well as big drops.
The direction Jagex has been taking the game would be rather interesting if they eliminated bots anyways.

I remember when I cared slightly about ranks, but there are so many people now that it's hard to care. Maybe you do, but I really don't care if the guy ahead of me botted all his skills rather than playing 10 more hours a day than me. The "best" in RuneScape are determined who has the most amount of free time and who dedicates the most amount of their free time to RS and to a degree how efficiently they use that time. I've already realized that highscores that reflect that were meaningless to me. So bots furthering that meaninglessness is irrelevant to me, but maybe some people do care I guess. But you think bots taint the highscores, I think the highscores are tainted by design.


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