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Mccain OR Obama
Mccain 13%  13%  [ 12 ]
Mccain 13%  13%  [ 12 ]
Obama 24%  24%  [ 23 ]
Obama 24%  24%  [ 23 ]
Neither 5%  5%  [ 5 ]
Neither 5%  5%  [ 5 ]
Don't care 8%  8%  [ 8 ]
Don't care 8%  8%  [ 8 ]
Total votes: 96
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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 11:21 am 
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Okay, I know it's pointless to argue who is "going" to be president with how things look at the moment, but we can still debate on who "should" be president. I don't want to hear anyone saying "Oh well, obama already won". Last time I checked, it isn't November 4th.


Any way, here is how it breaks down WITH NO PREJUDICE:

War Strategy:
--Obama:
He plans on pulling out, no questions asked. This would lead to about a week of peace and then we'll see Iraq and Afiganistan break out in civil wars. In about a month or two following this we will see HUGE boosts in gas prices, followed by an even higher raise in world travel. Next, in about 5 months, the civil wars will be brought to America. No matter what you see in this war, you cannot forget that the biggest contributing factor is that it is being pushed by a group of people who hate the modern world, and the modern world is lead by the ideals of the "American Way of Life". Thus, they have a tremendous hatred of America and what we value. They will try to ask us to ally with a side, because they will feel that since Obama has had PAST MUSLIM SCHOOLING (not current, he's christian, not a muslim. Dear god, get your facts straight before you argue something that will change the world.) he will side with them. After we say no, they will undoubtedly begin to attack the cities. Probably starting in the subway systems and then moving to buildings. Thus, Obama's plans for leaving the war will do no more than bring it back to life 7 years ago.

--McCain
McCain wants the war to end. Seriously, no joke. Anybody alive in the world wants this war to end. However, McCain knows that you can't just be a **** ***** and cry to your ***** *** parents about a problem you don't want to be in. We're in this war and we can't leave. Stop being babies about it. I swear to god, if you people would just realize that the mistake has been made and we have to live with it. THERE IS NO BACKING OUT!!! The only way to actually end this war is to eradicate enough of the problem to set up safe precautions against possible attacks in the country that the war is being held in. Basically, we have to make sure we kill more of them then they kill us. Then, we have to set up local Military camps that can hold their own. As long as they don't die off quicker than they can kill, it will be fine. But first we have to own up to our title of being the "Strongest Country" and actually do something for once. So basically, in the end, McCain's strategy will take longer, and will probably involve more recent deaths, but it will be far far far more effective and safer for the nation overall.



Economy:
--Obama:
He wants to lower taxes for all people making less than $250,000 a year and raise taxes of big business. This is a trick to make people think they are making more money. You aren't, and you are just falling into a political trap. It wont help you at all. Sure, you'll be paying less and thus you keep more income. However, you have to realize that if the company you work for is being taxed more, then they will being to pay you less to compensate for the loss. Thus, you are taxed less, but paid less as well. So in the end you make the exact same amount you are now. Woo-hoo...

--McCain:
His tax plans will effect less people, but they allow businesses to pay the people that work for them the same. Thus, although less people get tax breaks, the people that do will actually benefit. And most likely, the people that actually get effected are the ones that really need the money.



Energy:
--Obama:
He support clean energy. Enough said. However, gas prices will probably rise due to our trying to get away from it. Also, as we switch to different fuels there will be periods of time where gas will be nearly a fortune and you wont be able to access the new energy yet. Although the transition will be rough, it will greatly be worth it.

--McCain:
Supports drilling. This will help the economy, and will most likely supply thousands of jobs. However, it will only help global warming get worse and will screw us up in the future. Personally, me being the next generation and all, I really want to live past 40 without burning to death from solar radiation or suffocate in my own CO2 footprint...






To Brad:

Hey, you replied while I was typing so forgive the contriteness of this post lol.

Bush actually didn't have a say in the war. If you look at congressional documents then you would find that Cheny's speech declared war and that bush never gave any say untill after the fact. It was the first war in American history that the congress, nor the preisdent, had a say and that was declared solely by the vice president. Although Bush is a huge backer of the war and most definitely used it to gain Oil power, he didn't start it.

Also, the war may have been used to find non-existent WMD's it was justified in that we found extreme anti-American views and groups that were planning on attacking America again. There are documents about this. You can't say I'm wrong, and if you do try to then you're the one that is uninformed and you are the one that believes what you are told and not what you yourself have uncovered.

The terrorist groups we against now had a two step plan.
1) Eradicate new ideology in Rome and reclaim they're rightful land.
2) Eradicate the place that started the new ideology. This included the Americas (not USA, the America's as in the Continents)

It would've been a matter of years till we were attacked. Personally, I would rather start a war to soon for them in their land than allow them to get ready and bring it to us. They're innocent are worth less to me than ours. It's the way the world is. Is your family worth more to you than mine? Obviously you want them safer than mine, and you would rather mine be in danger than yours. It's the way humans are.

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 Post subject: Register and login to get these in-post ads to disappear
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 11:21 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 11:39 am 
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Seems like rsbnadb is filled with mostly liberals.
you could definitly tell that from the podcast lol.


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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 1:10 pm 
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At this point, I agree with the 75 some odd percent of Americans when I say I disapprove of Bush. If McCain supports Bush, and has all this time during his moronic reign in office, I can't say I'd vote for him.

I'm not for Obama 100%, but I'd certinally vote for him over McCain. (And yes, I could have voted this year. No I didn't. I live in Vermont, and I guarantee my vote wouldn't matter..We're going Democrat.) I think Obama will be the best President given the options (and vice-options :roll:), but I doubt he'll be reelected in 2012. He's got too big of a hole to dig the country out of, and no matter what he does I doubt he'll be able to keep a high rating throughout the term in office.

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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 1:29 pm 
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Ranging God wrote:
Tal Ormanda wrote:
They're both stupid in my opinion.



BUT if i have to choose, McCain hands down, and here is why.

Experience..

Easily said.



ooo i love how conservatives are still bashing obama about experience and yet mccain wants palin to be VP. and she has less experience than obama. how interesting.

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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 1:31 pm 
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trekkie wrote:
Ranging God wrote:
Tal Ormanda wrote:
They're both stupid in my opinion.



BUT if i have to choose, McCain hands down, and here is why.

Experience..

Easily said.



ooo i love how conservatives are still bashing obama about experience and yet mccain wants palin to be VP. and she has less experience than obama. how interesting.



That's why she's Vice President.


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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 1:31 pm 
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Why say that trekkie? Palin was a mayor first and has more hours than Obama.

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 Post subject: Register and login to get these in-post ads to disappear
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 1:31 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 2:18 pm 
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trekkie wrote:
Ranging God wrote:
Tal Ormanda wrote:
They're both stupid in my opinion.



BUT if i have to choose, McCain hands down, and here is why.

Experience..

Easily said.



ooo i love how conservatives are still bashing obama about experience and yet mccain wants palin to be VP. and she has less experience than obama. how interesting.



Ok, tell me how Obama has had more experience than Palin (and just to be fair, we are comparing VP to P)

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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 2:19 pm 
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look throughout history. everything goes worse with democrats (no offence, but it's true) we at least need a rep. congress

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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 2:48 pm 
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nikeballa435 wrote:
I voted for Obama. I personally think that if you voted for McCain and Palin you are messed up.

The war: Obama wants out, I am for that.

The economy: Both Obama and McCain want to fix it.

Education: McCain supports "no child left behind act, which is crap."

Energy: Obama wants to work on getting clean energy. McCain wants to keep drilling oil. WTF. We NEED to get off foriegn oil.

Now about the canidates themselves. Get religion out. Organized religion is screwed up anyways. Just because Obama is muslim, doesn't make him a terrorist. The terrorists are just a bunch of f***ed up people who happen to be muslim. Not all muslims are bad.

McCain is old. Get somebody who isn't gonna die soon. (lol he isn't gonna die soon it just sounds funny.) He is too old to realize what is good for the American people. Just take a look at your grandparents. MOST of them are completely out of it and not hip at all. McCain voted with George Bush 90% of the time. George W. Bush is the worst president in the history of our country. He screwed up the war, the economy and other things.

VP's: Joe Biden isn't the greatest canidate, but he isn't that bad. I know one thing about him and that is that he doesn't like guns. I am all for this. Civilians have no reason to carry a gun. NO LEGITIMATE REASON. If the police force would pull the sticks out of their asses and lighten up then they could do something.

SARAH PALIN = **** noob. Are you joking.
Her vocabulary:
Maverick- Me and John McCain.
Shut the **** up about mavericks. She is soo dumb. She has no experience. I can see Russia from my house. Hey guess what pull your head out of you *** and see what your daughter is doing in her bedroom.
DID YOU KNOW? Sarah Palin made it legal in alaska to fly around in a helicopter and shoot animals. WTF. Are you serious. Get a life. She is Soooooooooooo Stupid.

Dirtbiking said that Democrats are voting for Obama because Sarah Palin and George Bush suck. Yea pretty much. Because Palin is dumb, and Bush and McCain are very similar.

Change! Yes we can! O baby Obama!


since i dont want this to "get out of hand" again..ill be nice this time and only poke a few holes in your post...

Quote:
The war: Obama wants out, I am for that.

so does McCain, but he doesnt want to jump out when we are not done yet.

Quote:
McCain wants to keep drilling oil. WTF. We NEED to get off foriegn oil.

by drilling i take it you mean off shore drilling (thats what they've been talking about on the news) yeah, thats on our OWN LAND.

Quote:
Obama is muslim

no, he has said many many times he is not. you should know that haveing voted for him...

Quote:
McCain is old. Get somebody who isn't gonna die soon.

even if thats some how a joke. you dont know when McCain is going to die, for all you know Obama could be killed today...

Quote:
Civilians have no reason to carry a gun. NO LEGITIMATE REASON.

in order to keep my self from "getting a #3" ill shut up about this.

Quote:
SARAH PALIN = **** noob.

yeah, she's new. but in the time she has been in, she has done much more then Obama has.

Quote:
She has no experience.

nor does Obama, only she is running for VP...


ok, now please dont think i am in anyway flameing or flame baiting you. i was as nice as i could make my self be.
i hope you and everyone here can see im not flameing you or anyone else here. im being nice.

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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 3:40 pm 
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Sorry for not replying to you Joint, but I want to go back to what trekkie said.






Palin is going to be VICE President. She will have no more power in decision and overall standing than a senator or congressman would. She will never get the final say in anything and will serve as little more than a voice in McCain's ear. Oh wow, that's a lot to do. I wonder how she'll EVER be able to pull it off.../sarcasm
Obama is running for the real thing! He has the final decision in nearly everything! He needs to be experienced, as opposed to Vice president who doesn't! Why on earth would you compare the two?! That's like me comparing the cashier of a McDonalds to the Owner of WalMart. It's two totally different things...

Yeah, us conservatives are sure crazy for pointing out inexperience where it matters. Maybe we should just sit back and let a 4-year-old take the position of Treasurer. I bet it would have enough experience with Barny's shiny gold coins to handle the entire country's money. Wow, Liberals sure know what they're talking about.

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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 3:51 pm 
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Back at Brad:

You don't have to tell me that I'm inexperienced with the country, that I actually live in. I know about buisness management, I'm taking a class in it, I know what I'm talking about. The head directors, Fanny Mae and Mac CEO's played a huge role in the crashing of the market. Maybe you don't understand this, but I don't feel the need to explain myself again.

Another thing, President bush had a say in the war, but he doesn't make the final call. To go to war, first the president is acknowledged, if it ever even gets to him, and if he wants to take it further, he directs it at United Nations for them to make the final decision. Also Bush administration accused Iraq of stockpiling weapons of mass destruction and argued that Saddam Hussein's regime posed a grave threat to U.S. security and peace in the region. That's a huge reason to why we went to war with iraq, also we wanted them to have democracy. DON'T call Bush stupid because he wants Iraq to have democracy, if you are, when we went to vietnam for that war, that was the same concept, except with a democrat president.

All in all, if you're going to say Bush is stupid for wanting Democracry in Iraq just look back at the Vietnam war.

The thing I find weird also, is that Obama wants to change our national anthem? That's uncalled for. Also, all these terrorist interactions that have been cited with Obama, is unnecessarily and proves a lot to who he could and can be.

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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 3:57 pm 
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Dirtbiking06 wrote:
Back at Brad:

You don't have to tell me that I'm inexperienced with the country, that I actually live in. I know about buisness management, I'm taking a class in it, I know what I'm talking about. The head directors, Fanny Mae and Mac CEO's played a huge role in the crashing of the market. Maybe you don't understand this, but I don't feel the need to explain myself again.

Another thing, President bush had a say in the war, but he doesn't make the final call. To go to war, first the president is acknowledged, if it ever even gets to him, and if he wants to take it further, he directs it at United Nations for them to make the final decision. Also Bush administration accused Iraq of stockpiling weapons of mass destruction and argued that Saddam Hussein's regime posed a grave threat to U.S. security and peace in the region. That's a huge reason to why we went to war with iraq, also we wanted them to have democracy. DON'T call Bush stupid because he wants Iraq to have democracy, if you are, when we went to vietnam for that war, that was the same concept, except with a democrat president.

All in all, if you're going to say Bush is stupid for wanting Democracry in Iraq just look back at the Vietnam war.

The thing I find weird also, is that Obama wants to change our national anthem? That's uncalled for. Also, all these terrorist interactions that have been cited with Obama, is unnecessarily and proves a lot to who he could and can be.


The UN didn't give the US & UK permission to invade Iraq but they did it anyway. The whole 'I live here so I know everything about Bush' stance doesn't work well when you miss a vital fact such as that.

Your entire argument unravels around the fact you don't even know that basic, but crucial, fact. Like I told you before, I'm not interested in the same old rhetoric you're spewing. Either research your arguments properly or I'm really not interested in this debate. Because you're just proving yourself wrong. Although if you'd like to just let out your rage at me through a barrage of personal insults, just PM me.

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 Post subject: Re: Mccain OR Obama
PostPosted: November 2nd, 2008, 4:01 pm 
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As I stated before I would lock this if it started to get out of hand and clearly it has. If you want to complain about it feel free to send me a pm.

We'll see on Tuesday what happens. We'll have plenty of time for another one of these topics about what went wrong for one of the candidates :P

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