Osama bin Laden is Dead

trekkie · **Posted:** May 2nd, 2011, 11:01 pm

well also remember, when 9/11 happened they were also cheering and handing out free food to people celebrating the death of our citizens.

we again did it again when saddam was caught and hung.

i would say it was right of us to celebrate the end of the rein of terror.

Adbot · **Posted:** May 2nd, 2011, 11:01 pm

Warren · **Posted:** May 3rd, 2011, 8:30 am

Quote:

well also remember, when 9/11 happened they were also cheering and handing out free food to people celebrating the death of our citizens.

So ugh is America better than the terrorists or are the terrorists just good [lol well not good but idk other word]. I guess it's a bit different given the difference of the death their celebrating though but wouldn't they think America are terrorists because in their mind they're FREEDOM FIGHTAHS YEEEA

ryan1 · **Posted:** May 3rd, 2011, 2:26 pm

Rune Beast0 wrote:

...We could torture detainees (not talking about waterboarding, although look at the scandal that caused) or bomb indiscriminately, but we don't...

I do seriously hope you're joking.
Torture
http://www.forbes.com/feeds/afx/2005/06/24/afx2110388.html
Indiscriminate bombing
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7Rws2VLqpY

Anyway, the death of Osama means nothing to me. Great, we killed one man. It only took 6,000 US soldiers' deaths, $1,000,000,000,000, and ten years. And for what? The only thing that has been accomplished is petty revenge. Al Qaeda won't go away. The violence won't stop. The war will continue.

Rune Beast0 · **Posted:** May 3rd, 2011, 3:22 pm

ryan1 wrote:

Rune Beast0 wrote:

...We could torture detainees (not talking about waterboarding, although look at the scandal that caused) or bomb indiscriminately, but we don't...

I do seriously hope you're joking.
Torture
http://www.forbes.com/feeds/afx/2005/06/24/afx2110388.html
Indiscriminate bombing
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7Rws2VLqpY

Anyway, the death of Osama means nothing to me. Great, we killed one man. It only took 6,000 US soldiers' deaths, $1,000,000,000,000, and ten years. And for what? The only thing that has been accomplished is petty revenge. Al Qaeda won't go away. The violence won't stop. The war will continue.

In the first link:

Quote:

hearings in May 2006.

Quote:

The document from Washington will not be formally made public until the hearings.

Where is this document? What happened in this hearing? For all we know, they're talking about playing loud music. By torture I was referring to grave human rights abuses - think of things that happened under Japan in WWII or Vietnamese POW camps, think of the things that have happened to our own troops overseas. Would it help us to extract information if we chopped off a finger every time someone said they had nothing to do with a terror plot? Probably, but we don't do it because of that higher moral standard.

For the second:
in·dis·crim·i·nate
[in-di-skrim-uh-nit]
–adjective
1.
not discriminating; lacking in care, judgment, selectivity, etc.: indiscriminate in one's friendships.
2.
not discriminate; haphazard; thoughtless: indiscriminate slaughter.

Until you can get evidence (other than a video that's at least somewhat biased - note the guy "correcting" himself after essentially saying we're at war over oil resources) about the civilian-to-insurgent ratio in attacks, you can't accuse us of just shooting anything that moves. Even in your video, the number of civilians was only for extremely high-level targets. If we could get intel on someone who is in charge of a group that indiscriminately kills civilians both in Coalition countries and in Iraq/Afghanistan/wherever, there is no option but to strike before they move. Also, "civilian" in this usage means people that have not been 100% confirmed for insurgents. Many of the people who would be hiding/protecting Saddam or some other high-level target are not on our side, yet they will still count as "civilian" deaths. Obviously for your average band of Taliban fighters, we're not going to risk killing an entire village's worth of civilians. The whole point of the war in the Middle East is to equip the populace to fight terrorism by themselves; creating more hatred against us and more terrorism is defeating the purpose and it makes no logical sense to risk the lives of civilians unless the circumstances are very special.

Ice · Runite: 9/30/2010

I didn't read the articles that Earth linked to so I'll just type out everything I know.

Obama is in the White House. CIA Director is in the 7th floor of the CIA HQ in Langely, Virginia. They're both looking a TV screen. What's on the screen is what the pilots of the helicopters are seeing as they fly across Pakistan (they flew across the whole country and back again) to the edge of the Kashmir/Pakistan border (really close to a Pakistani base as you know). Right as one of the copters is almost right above the bunker/house/thingy where Bin Laden is, a sandstorm kicks up. That copter goes down. Thankfully this time, the guys in that copter survive (referring to President Carter incident). The other copters touch down and they shoot and kill Bin Laden (did you know his wife was shot too but survived?) Obama/Director watch it all go down (hence they've got Bin Laden getting shot on video, which we have not yet seen the whole thing of). They grab Bin Laden's body and fly back across Pakistan to Afghanistan (couldn't go by way of India even though India is friendly because if Pakistan saw copters come over Kashmir from India, they'd declare war on India).

By the way, we found Bin Laden by stalking his couriers for about 4-5 years. (He wasn't doing anything at all electronically so he used humans to deliver his messages, just fyi). And it actually wasn't a relative of his who led us straight to him.

Now the interesting thing is that whenever we do something that usually involved the Middle East, Pakistanis take to the streets, go in front of a camera, and yell, "Death to America" or "America is evil" yada yada. But you know what? Sunday, Monday, end of Tuesday, nothing from the Pakistani. They haven't taken to the streets and gone ballistic that we went into (over, technically) their country and killed someone they were supposedly protecting (which now has 50% of America calling them a terrorist nation) and actually flew over the country one more time to leave. So now everyone's wondering what's going on.

It's a really interesting fact considering the layout of the Middle East, which is Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, India. It's terrorist, terrorist, terrorist, ?, friend.

Just another FYI, in 2001 we believed Bin Laden to be in between Afghanistan and Pakistan in the Caves (where we initially believed we killed him) and ten years later he's on the other side of Pakistan o the edge of Kashmir.

And while yes, this definitely helps Obama for re-election but realize that if it turns out Obama lied (it doesn't particularly matter if Osama is alive or was killed earlier, Obama lied is the point), he will never ever get re elected. He'll get destroyed if he runs, like Carter was.

A little off topic but has anyone seen that picture of Obama at that conference table with a crapload of other people? I couldn't help but laugh a little when I see H. Clinton covering her mouth with her hand. She had a total "oh ****" look on her face XD

Slightly back on topic, my AP Gov't teacher said he'll quit teaching US Gov't (but still teach other things) if it turns out Obama lied because he was in high school when Watergate came out so he doesn't want to his career to be from Watergate to Obama lying. Not exactly a stellar example of the US Gov't, hm?

trekkie · **Posted:** May 4th, 2011, 9:22 am

i don't really think he would lie. but what i am looking forward to is all the conspiracy theories popping up.

"it wasn't bin laden, it was an alien from mars that escaped into pakistan and we were trying to retrieve it. and because they didn't want the public to know, they said it was bin laden who we killed back in 2009 in a mule accident."

Adbot · **Posted:** May 4th, 2011, 9:22 am

ryan1 · **Posted:** May 5th, 2011, 6:25 am

Spoiler for massive quotes:

Rune Beast0 wrote:

ryan1 wrote:

Rune Beast0 wrote:

...We could torture detainees (not talking about waterboarding, although look at the scandal that caused) or bomb indiscriminately, but we don't...

I do seriously hope you're joking.
Torture
http://www.forbes.com/feeds/afx/2005/06/24/afx2110388.html
Indiscriminate bombing
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7Rws2VLqpY

Anyway, the death of Osama means nothing to me. Great, we killed one man. It only took 6,000 US soldiers' deaths, $1,000,000,000,000, and ten years. And for what? The only thing that has been accomplished is petty revenge. Al Qaeda won't go away. The violence won't stop. The war will continue.

In the first link:

Quote:

hearings in May 2006.

Quote:

The document from Washington will not be formally made public until the hearings.

Where is this document? What happened in this hearing? For all we know, they're talking about playing loud music. By torture I was referring to grave human rights abuses - think of things that happened under Japan in WWII or Vietnamese POW camps, think of the things that have happened to our own troops overseas. Would it help us to extract information if we chopped off a finger every time someone said they had nothing to do with a terror plot? Probably, but we don't do it because of that higher moral standard.

For the second:
in·dis·crim·i·nate
[in-di-skrim-uh-nit]
–adjective
1.
not discriminating; lacking in care, judgment, selectivity, etc.: indiscriminate in one's friendships.
2.
not discriminate; haphazard; thoughtless: indiscriminate slaughter.

Until you can get evidence (other than a video that's at least somewhat biased - note the guy "correcting" himself after essentially saying we're at war over oil resources) about the civilian-to-insurgent ratio in attacks, you can't accuse us of just shooting anything that moves. Even in your video, the number of civilians was only for extremely high-level targets. If we could get intel on someone who is in charge of a group that indiscriminately kills civilians both in Coalition countries and in Iraq/Afghanistan/wherever, there is no option but to strike before they move. Also, "civilian" in this usage means people that have not been 100% confirmed for insurgents. Many of the people who would be hiding/protecting Saddam or some other high-level target are not on our side, yet they will still count as "civilian" deaths. Obviously for your average band of Taliban fighters, we're not going to risk killing an entire village's worth of civilians. The whole point of the war in the Middle East is to equip the populace to fight terrorism by themselves; creating more hatred against us and more terrorism is defeating the purpose and it makes no logical sense to risk the lives of civilians unless the circumstances are very special.

Those are good points. To be honest, I didn't have time to thoroughly read the article I linked. My point was that it's not really fair to say something like "We're better than them as if they are all just hideous monsters and we're the bright angels in shining armor who are doing nothing wrong in this conflict.

trekkie · **Posted:** May 25th, 2011, 11:11 pm

well semi interesting news.

WASHINGTON – Home movies taken from Osama bin Laden's hideout show the terrorist leader watching news coverage of himself on television.

The videos were seized by Navy SEALs after bin Laden was killed Monday. They were shown to reporters Saturday by intelligence officials.

The five movies offer the first public glimpse at bin Laden's life behind the walls of his compound in suburban Pakistan. The government-selected clips also provide an opportunity for the U.S. to paint bin Laden in an unflattering light to his supporters. They video include outtakes of his propaganda films and, taken together, portray him as someone obsessed with his own image and how he is portrayed to the world.

so yeah, lets see what's on the videos maybe it will show that bin laden was at least there very recently.

i do wonder if they show videos of him surrounded by 72 virgins.

last osama edit

Monday morning, Osama Bin Laden found himself "crossed-over" into the afterlife. Anxious to find his eternal reward, he looks around, and off in the distance sees Mohammed. Elated, he breaks into a run toward his beloved prophet.

But before he gets there, he is intercepted by a tall white gentleman wearing a wig and tri-cornered hat. The man introduces himself: "Hi. I'm George. You attacked my country, and I wanted to personally welcome you to eternity."

After which our founding President doubles Osama over with strong American punch to the solar-plexus. Then Thomas Jefferson walks up and with a quick self-introduction and "welcome to eternity" knees Bin Laden in the face, breaking his nose and sending him to the ground.

Next Patrick Henry gives a similar welcome and joins in, employing his boot in breaking a few of Osama's ribs. Curled up in pain Bin Laden looks to see a long line of similarly dressed men coming to beat the crap out of him.

He casts his eyes toward Mohammed and begs, "Blessed prophet, this is not what you promised me for eternity!" To which Mohammed replies, "Oh, did I say virgins? I meant Virginians."